16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine?? - Toyota Tacoma Forum
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#1 (permalink) Old 11-20-2004, 11:38 PM
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16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Has anyone ever heard of any aftermarket companies making a 16 Valve twin cam Hemi design head for a 22R/22RE engine? I notice people selling bran new aftermarket casting heads on eBay and figured some one should develope a performance head if they have the capabilites to duplicate an origonal Toyota head. There are millions and millions of those 22R/22RE engines still going today and anyone that builds a 16 Valve head for a 22R block would be sitting on a gold mine.

Matt
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#2 (permalink) Old 11-21-2004, 12:16 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Wouldn't that be nice... you can convert an older lightning 2v head to the new 4v had and even the new manifold if you want. A 16v for the 22r would be nice but I guess totally custom and big bucks. Why not go up to the 3rz?
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#3 (permalink) Old 11-21-2004, 12:49 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Hey Fluff,
The Idea I'm thinking is since there are so many older 22R/22RE engines still around and people willing to pile thousands of dollars into them. Someone could mass produce a twin cam 16 valve head for a 22R/22RE so that the original intake manifold/plenum and current 22R/22RE production headers could remain in place and not have to do an expensive engine swap to keep up with the power outputs of the modern 2RZ/3RZ Taco engines. I have seen turbo kits available for the 22RE engines that are nearly $3000. Now if one of these engine head companies tooled up for a performance head. I would imagine people would be lining up to buy one even if they were in the $1000 to $1500 price range. They already seem to be able to cast new OEM style head and sell them for under $350 and do performance ported polished heads with stainless steel valves and a performace cam for about $600. If the aftermarket companies have the ability to achieve that. Then why not a custom 16 valve head?

Matt
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#4 (permalink) Old 11-21-2004, 01:51 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

You're talking about two different things... a reproduction of a stock head and a totally custom head. Are there any dual cam 22rs out there? It would have to be totally custom to be DOHC.. It's possible but why? The 2/3rz motors have set a new standard and you can get one for very little and throw a set of pistons and rods in it and blow 40 psi thru the mutha... why worry about a custom head for the 22r when you can just swap it for the newer motor and make even more power. How much will a 22 support with only rods and pistons? CNC heads don't go for less than a grand and if you're talking about a totally custom head you'll be waaaay over that.
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#5 (permalink) Old 11-21-2004, 02:40 PM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Hey Fluff,
Your probably right about the newer engines and all and the expence for a custom head for a 22R/22RE engine. However, Like anything else. When there are only a very few made "prototypes" then that is why the cost would be so high. But if a well rounded machine shop/head builder were to do some checking arround and get an idea how much of interest there would be for a head like that. I'm sure the interest would be very high. The higher the production numbers. The lower the cost to make a head. A good example is the Chevy small block engines. There are models of chevy engines that chevy has not produced in over 35 years and you can get all kinds of custom heads "even aluminum heads" and parts for them to this day. You an I know there are a hell of a lot more 22R/22RE engine running as we speak than those old Chevy 327s & 283s. I know there would be more people intersted in simply just swapping a head onto there existing engine and just bolt everyting back up and have the exhuast and all in the correct location. Rather than go through the extensive surgery of swaping a newer engine. Don't get me wrong. I did a swap my self "3.0 3VZE V6 to a 3.4 5VZ-FE V6", but I am capable of doing that my self unlike a majority of guys that would be able to handle a simple head swap instead. The 22R/22RE has a tough bottom end and can be made to hold up to major performance mods, but the head is the bottle neck that prevents it from keeping up with a 2RZ or 3RZ power ranges. Basicly I am saying is the 22R/22RE is a proven engine with over 20 production years backing it up. It is a VERY popular engine and has a lot of potential. Just like the old chevy 283s and 327s. Throw on a set of Edelbrock aluminum head and they really picked up the pace. Since Edelbrock does make custom heads. I am surprised they don't look into a custom head for the 22R 22RE engines. They certainly could tool up and produce them for a resonable price. They build other things for the Toyota engines. Maybe a head someday. The 22R/22RE is to Toyota like the 327 and 283 is to Chevy. Sure later models came along with more technology in the chevy engines. But there is a good reason people will not give up there good ol classic proven 327 & 283. Good design, Tough and ran good. 22R/22RE engines have all those characteristics. Especially lasting forever. I know the mentality that still exist about Toyota and or most imports and Domestic vehicles. Most companies are hesitant till recent years to build some aftermarket items for japaneese vehicles becuse most people think Jap vehicles will never hold value and all will be sold for scrap in 10 to 15 years. Well, the trend is changing and people are starting to collect 60s,70s & some 80s Jap vehicles and restoring them or making sleepers out of them. Sorry about the long entery, just throwing out an idea to people that should get some serious thought from someone capable of building a head.

Matt
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#6 (permalink) Old 11-22-2004, 12:03 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

22r with dohc= 2/3rz
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#7 (permalink) Old 11-22-2004, 02:44 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Exactly, and for most people. A DOHC head swap would be a lot easier than a tranny and engine swap which requires a lot of custom work. keeping a 22R series block means all the accessories such as A/C, Alternator, Power steering pump, Intake with all wires and hoses, Radiator and the exhaust can remain original to the truck. A head swap would be a much better choice for those people with Automatics. To swap a 2/3RZ into an older truck with an automatic tranny would be a wiring nightmare since the tranny is computer controled also and there is a lot of wiring intigrated into the dash wiring for the automatics. Not everyone is willing to sacrifice their automatic tranny just to get the power of the 2/3RZ into their pre taco truck. Anyone that has ever driven a pretaco 4 cylinder automatic 4x4 truck or 4Runner knows that they are the most gutless truck/4Runner ever to roll off of Toyota's assembly line. The 4x4 automatic trucks with a 22R/22RE engine are the first canidates for a DOHC head swap.
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#8 (permalink) Old 11-23-2004, 02:27 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Listen, I don't want to talk shiz with my toyota truck brothren. I'm really not sure. I know there have been many 22 motors with very very high hp figures BUT it doesn't compare to what they have done with both the 2 and 3 RZ as far as I know. Have any 22r motors ran 8s or 6s? If you're really serious and want to drop the dime on a doch head, you wouldn't think twice about dropping the new motor in. If you want your truck to go fast, I',m sure we can help you. There's one guy that dropped a 3.4 SC'd motor into a pretaco 2wd xcab and it's really fast... Maybe you should explore other avenues. If you drop $1500 into a 2rz (the little of the two) it's possible to make 600+ horse with only bolt ons, if you spend 1500 on a custom head for a 22r will it be able to match that? Considering you'd need internals in addition to the custom head to come even close to that with the older motor why not do some wiring and fabricating and drop the newer motor in? I know you're a 22 fan but you are in a taco forum after all BTW I have the v6 and sometimes I wish I had a 3rz...
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#9 (permalink) Old 11-23-2004, 01:44 PM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

changing a 22r to a dohc head would be way more trouble than its worth. besides the nitemare of designing and producing the head, think of all the changes you'd need to make to the front cover... you'd need to design the chain system to turn the cams... it's just not worth it. you'd be money ahead swapping the 22r for a 2rz or 3rz.... maybe even a 5vz
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#10 (permalink) Old 11-24-2004, 11:22 AM
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Re: 16 Valve Twin Cam head for a 22R/22RE engine??

Have already done a 5VZ Conversion.

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